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Page 123: not much to see 
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Joined: Wed May 20, 2015 2:14 am
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Post Page 123: not much to see
Happy new year everyone!


And it starts good, a new page is up: http://well-of-souls.com/outsider/outsider123.html
Thank you Arioch!

Yes, we're nearing "tactical"... But too far away from the action...

And we now know that the paths (jumppoints) to other systems may be outside of the plane of the system.

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charred steppes, borders of territories: page 59,
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Mon Jan 01, 2018 2:10 am
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Post Re: Page 123: not much to see
Krulle wrote:
Happy new year everyone!


And it starts good, a new page is up: http://well-of-souls.com/outsider/outsider123.html
Thank you Arioch!

Yes, we're nearing "tactical"... But too far away from the action...

And we now know that the paths (jumppoints) to other systems may be outside of the plane of the system.


Yay! The new year just got a little happier ;)


Mon Jan 01, 2018 5:22 am
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Post Re: Page 123: not much to see
Great in-system map, I love maps and tactical overviews in Outsider, they're wery well designed and thought out. A nice New Year's present :-)


Mon Jan 01, 2018 5:42 am
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Post Re: Page 123: not much to see
Is it just me or did that "Oh, captain my captain, you learn sooooo fast" from Beryl seems almost TOO xenophilic?

Unless she's actually being sarcastic. "Wow, you picked up on how to use our most basic level consoles, the kind so simple we have them installed for use by the Tenoin caste, in a mere 20 minutes. *pfffft*"


Mon Jan 01, 2018 5:59 am
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Post Re: Page 123: not much to see
boldilocks wrote:
Is it just me or did that "Oh, captain my captain, you learn sooooo fast" from Beryl seems almost TOO xenophilic?

Unless she's actually being sarcastic. "Wow, you picked up on how to use our most basic level consoles, the kind so simple we have them installed for use by the Tenoin caste, in a mere 20 minutes. *pfffft*"


Haha, yes a comment on that by Arioch might be interesting. Maybe she is just patronizing the "little male" that tries stuff reserved for females ;) But maybe it's also more.

Btw. great work on the rise and fall expansion overview, especially the culture/civic tree.


Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:02 am
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Post Re: Page 123: not much to see
And what is that gesture she's doing?

I'm inclined to agree with Boldilocks. She seems FAR too pleased and interested in Alex for such a simple task. Maybe she enjoys the idea of enlightening the savage?

I mean, showing the alien your (implicitly far superior) ways is something of a staple of sci-fi. Maybe Beryl's mainlining some similar sort of sentiment?


Mon Jan 01, 2018 11:13 am
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Post Re: Page 123: not much to see
I think it might be closer to pride in showing someone something that they have never done before. Almost like a master apprentice thing really, "Well you seem to be getting the hang of that very quickly. " While there are most certainly things that I have seen in this story which could be seen as sarcasm or condensation this does not feel like one of the. Perhaps rightfully so as well. Lets also not forget, when it comes to the genetic lottery the Loroi hit almost every number with out exception in comparison to us except maybe height.


Mon Jan 01, 2018 11:26 am
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Post Re: Page 123: not much to see
hi hi

Humans do seem to have an advantage in figuring out new things, when compared to the Loroi, at least on the macro scale. Mostly that is due to cultural reasons, since the Loroi culture is not one that traditionally promotes advancing outside of one's station among other things. There are lots of people who get really confused by user interfaces and end up having to get help to accomplish their goals. (Trying to get my grandparents to use email was a thing.) Maybe many Loroi really aren't taught critical analysis, and would get lost.

Or maybe there's a sense of Loroi superiority showing through.


Mon Jan 01, 2018 12:24 pm
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Post Re: Page 123: not much to see
Alex is a male, handling such a console is something that Loroi males aren't expected to do and as such it should be somewhat of an achievement for a male who has never operated such a console and didn't even know the written script a few minutes earlier to be able to use the console with such confidence. In short she is 'matronizing' her student.

Taking everything into account there is also the possibility of Beryl subconsciously hitting on Alex, the interesting and smart alien who looks nearly identical to a Loroi male. At the very least Beryl is directly competing with Talon for his attention and knows she is at a disadvantage because of her use of 'Captain' when addressing him.

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Mon Jan 01, 2018 12:39 pm
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Post Re: Page 123: not much to see
hi hi

Actually, Loroi men are known for being educated. They even have their own scholar and philosopher castes. I mean, they have some demands on their time, but procreation isn't going to take nearly the same amount of time and effort as, say, constructing new buildings or starships.


Mon Jan 01, 2018 1:26 pm
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Post Re: Page 123: not much to see
I think you misunderstood me, handling simple electronics is something that most Loroi males are bound to know how to do but more complex and 'serious' stuff are bound to be left to the dominant females. Word of god is that Loroi males don't know how to do complex stuff like drive vehicles or pilot aircraft, whether this is because of a lack of trust by the dominant females or a sense of 'matronizing' pride is up to debate but as a rule Loroi males are very sheltered, protected and looked after. Many of them are undoubtedly achieved intellectuals and fulfill important duties but this doesn't change the fact that plenty of jobs are handled exclusively by Loroi females. Military grade equipment is something that is beyond a Loroi male.

Beryl is obviously genuinely surprised that an alien male who handles such a console for the first time right after being taught the Loroi Trade script, her behavior becoming Patronizing as a result of this and cultural upbringing is something to be expected.

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Mon Jan 01, 2018 3:15 pm
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Post Re: Page 123: not much to see
dragoongfa wrote:
Beryl is obviously genuinely surprised that an alien male who handles such a console for the first time right after being taught the Loroi Trade script, her behavior becoming Patronizing as a result of this and cultural upbringing is something to be expected.


But are loroi really that culturally sheltered? I mean they work in proximity with several other alien species, from what I understand. Unless they have a really paternalistic attitude towards those species, I suppose. Or perhaps the rank and file people aren't really all that much in contact with non-loroi individuals.


Mon Jan 01, 2018 3:40 pm
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Post Re: Page 123: not much to see
dragoongfa wrote:
Loroi males don't know how to do complex stuff like drive vehicles or pilot aircraft, whether this is because of a lack of trust by the dominant females or a sense of 'matronizing' pride is up to debate but as a rule Loroi males are very sheltered, protected and looked after.


Which raises the question: Are Loroi males allowed to drive cars? :shock: May they go out alone or do they have to be accompanied by an older sister? :shock:


Mon Jan 01, 2018 4:00 pm
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Post Re: Page 123: not much to see
From the way Clearbrook's vector bends on the tactical map, it looks like she's recalled from picket/courier duty on the Azimol jump zone.

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Mon Jan 01, 2018 4:31 pm
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Post Re: Page 123: not much to see
Arent wrote:
dragoongfa wrote:
Loroi males don't know how to do complex stuff like drive vehicles or pilot aircraft, whether this is because of a lack of trust by the dominant females or a sense of 'matronizing' pride is up to debate but as a rule Loroi males are very sheltered, protected and looked after.


Which raises the question: Are Loroi males allowed to drive cars? :shock: May they go out alone or do they have to be accompanied by an older sister? :shock:


a loroi male is more valuable resources then equal member of society so they would like always be under some level supervision at all time. maybe not armed guard level everywhere but when out in public where anyone could get to him yeah.


Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:41 pm
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Post Re: Page 123: not much to see
I think people are focused on Beryls opinion of Alex being the only thing about this, rather than her not actually knowing how to handle the situation in the way she wants.

However she was whenever she met a male last, there was zero ambiguity on why they met or for what purpose. They're a species where even if such things weren't structured so rigidly they have an entire venue of communication that'd likely be better served for it that's not applicable here.

She is a woman totally out of her depth. What she wants she wouldn't have much idea on how to actually ask for under "normal" circumstances. But the way she'd convey that is also just not an option. She's just kind of up the creek and trying desperatley to figure out how to get this alien to have diplomatic relations in her official chambers.


Mon Jan 01, 2018 9:11 pm
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Post Re: Page 123: not much to see
Have it occurred to you that the comment may not be related to him being male at all? ;)

We have an alien on board. He said just moments ago that he, surprisingly, did not read Loroi script. Loroi script was explained to him and lo and behold, he seems to be orienting himself not just in Loroi writing, but Loroi military user interface as well (potentially because humanoids think alike and arrange things based on some kind of underlying universal design principles?). Wouldn't you commend the alien?

It is likely just mildly surprising for Beryl that he seems so quick and comfortable working with Loroi technology he is seeing for the first time in his life. I think she is intellectually sufficiently advanced to understand that the Loroi gender biases do not apply to other species, regardless of how similar anatomically.


Tue Jan 02, 2018 1:23 am
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Post Re: Page 123: not much to see
I guess it's a little bit of everything. Her taking pride in her abilities to teach an alien which knows squat about the console layout and Loroi-Trade script in almost no time at all to a proficiency to actually handle things... Though the narrator (Alex) did say that he had to slow her down first. Then, Beryl being sort of impressed that even while being technologically inferior (as warranted by the general design of the Bellarmine and his space suit, as much as they can deduce it from the wreckage) individual humans can pick up things pretty fast (related to what?), and lastly, some blatant flirting, consciously or subconsciously.

I'm not sure her words about his learning prowess are ironic. She seemed genuinely surprised that he speaks Trade that well (since they do communicate and exchange complex thoughts), but never picked up the Loroi writing as well.

On another note... is it just me or does Talon's sidelong glance in http://www.well-of-souls.com/outsider/outsider120.html , second to last panel, look somehow like "I know what you're up to, and I'm not sure I approve." ?


Tue Jan 02, 2018 4:05 am
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Post Re: Page 123: not much to see
(Beginning was directed @Victor, but it turned into a more general post).

If I may make a broad assumption, I would guess that most of the readers of Outsider are male, so the topic of how an alien female would respond to an alien male is probably foremost in most of our minds. I try not to interpret Loroi dialogue as 'suggestive' for lack of a better term, since the concepts of dating and choosing a mate are probably pretty foreign to the Loroi. I don't think they would be thinking along the lines of, "If I compliment him he will like me more." which in turn could lead to 'other stuff'.

And I don't think we even know if they think a human is 'attractive' or not. I try to imagine seeing a woman with blue skin, like blue human skin, and while very sexy on page, I think an actual blue woman would look scary and/or weird.

THAT being said, it's not so much the dialogue, but the LOOK Beryl is giving Alex that makes me think there might me some there there. :D


Tue Jan 02, 2018 4:13 am
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Post Re: Page 123: not much to see
The look does make sense. It almost looks like she is quite impressed with his ability to learn quickly and is rather attracted to it. I mean how many aliens would look very similar to you, have similar interests to you, and be both smart and receptive like yourself. They are both young, intelligent, and he has been completely forthcoming with her answering every question to the best of his ability and even stumbling or showing surprise which I would not be surprised myself to find that she thinks it rather cute and attractive.

That look could, on the other side, be a symbol of Beryls own pride like, "God I am good, who else could handle this alien so well." Then again she might just be impressed with how quickly an alien is learning new things and there is no attraction there at all. After all we do not really know how Loroi "talk" to each other.

On a side note Talon might find him interesting because he is also a pilot himself and she finds that interesting. Brothers in arms like thing if you will. But to be honest he seemed to do a lot more of the instigation than her so maybe she is just curious. Though, they did touch.


Tue Jan 02, 2018 5:17 am
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Post Re: Page 123: not much to see
Are we to assume most of the dialog in the lower panel is being said by Beryl? Talon's grammar seems to have improved a bit since Alex's handshake.

CJSF


Tue Jan 02, 2018 5:32 am
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Post Re: Page 123: not much to see
Small question: when a word is written in bold front, does that mean the speaker is punctuating it for emphasis?


Tue Jan 02, 2018 5:55 am
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Post Re: Page 123: not much to see
raistlin34 wrote:
Small question: when a word is written in bold front, does that mean the speaker is punctuating it for emphasis?


Seems to be a mix:
"Now that seems like our Stray. Must have followed us from Naam."

Unless Talon is emphasizing names for Alex' benefit.


Tue Jan 02, 2018 6:37 am
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Post Re: Page 123: not much to see
Has it been explained, what the red icon to the right of Leido is?


Tue Jan 02, 2018 2:48 pm
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Post Re: Page 123: not much to see
raistlin34 wrote:
Small question: when a word is written in bold front, does that mean the speaker is punctuating it for emphasis?

Usually, but it's also a convention to emphasize proper nouns.

ewaggin wrote:
Has it been explained, what the red icon to the right of Leido is?

Those are system buoys.

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